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TOPIC: muscle gain + fat loss workout juggling

muscle gain + fat loss workout juggling 2 years 8 months ago #35598

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This is my first time posting :)
Overall my goal is to become bigger and stronger, i do hypertrophy/strength programs, eat 3k cals/day @ 6 meals/day but want to make sure my body fat doesnt cover up all my hard work! So im currently on a fat loss program where i eat 2.5k cals/day @ 6 meals/day and the program has 3x 4 week parts. Since i dont want my gains to deteriorate, should i do 1 part of the fat loss program, get my body fat % measured, and judge from that measurement if i should switch to strength/hypertrophy or continue to part 2 of the fat loss program? Or should i just do the 3 parts of the fat loss program in a row and get my body fat measured at the end? I want to get rid of body fat but dont want to lose too much muscle in the process. Do fat loss programs increase catabolism? Thank you!
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Re: muscle gain + fat loss workout juggling 2 years 8 months ago #35599

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Hello and welcome to Lift for Life,

Most diets are a bit catabolic but they don't have to be. At 2,500 cals/day you are likely at or above maintenance depending on caloric expenditure. The trick to minimizing muscle loss when cutting is to reduce the bodies need for internal sources of amino acids which means frequent protein intake. Additionally, supplementing with L-glutamine has a muscle sparing effect and is a relatively inexpensive insurance policy against muscle loss.

I consider Cytrainer (another member on this board) to be more up to date in this area than I and will hold further comment until I see what he has to say.

Thanks for joining!
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Re: muscle gain + fat loss workout juggling 2 years 8 months ago #35600

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khamil8686 wrote:
This is my first time posting :)
Overall my goal is to become bigger and stronger, i do hypertrophy/strength programs, eat 3k cals/day @ 6 meals/day but want to make sure my body fat doesnt cover up all my hard work! So im currently on a fat loss program where i eat 2.5k cals/day @ 6 meals/day and the program has 3x 4 week parts. Since i dont want my gains to deteriorate, should i do 1 part of the fat loss program, get my body fat % measured, and judge from that measurement if i should switch to strength/hypertrophy or continue to part 2 of the fat loss program? Or should i just do the 3 parts of the fat loss program in a row and get my body fat measured at the end? I want to get rid of body fat but dont want to lose too much muscle in the process. Do fat loss programs increase catabolism? Thank you!

Where have you determined your calorie totals from? are measuring all of these foods? Are you tracking your Protein/Carbs/Fats? This has to be done in order for this whole thing to work out for you in the long run? How long have you been doing this for and have you measured your bodyfat lately? see how much of this weight was for the better? The foods you eat are important as well as once you find the cals that maintain your weight, you also want to finid the macros that will work for you to maintain muscle and drop bodyfat and that's a very fine line, trust and will take some trial and error to get there.


Where have you got this training program from? Could you lay it out for me to see? Usually what got you there in terms of putting on your gains is something you would want to stick to and veer from too much, as if most fat loss programs will switch into endurance training and lots of cardio which will eventually lead to fat loss but along with that will be muscle as well!



Let me know about these things and we can go from there!
Craig Yarnall, CSCS, CPT, WNBF Pro
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Re: muscle gain + fat loss workout juggling 2 years 8 months ago #35605

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i got the calorie totals from the trainer at my gym, he said 3000 is good for strength/hypertrophy if you want to be cautious with your body fat, but 3400 would be best for gains. i also calculated my recommended daily calories for weight maintenance with a few methods i found online and also online calculators which all said around 2600 cals/day for maintenance since im very active. then he said for fat loss just reduce my strength/hypertrophy calories by about 500 cals. i measure all my foods daily via myfitnesspal.com app on my smartphone. i weigh 177lbs and yesterday i got 61/100g fat, 339/338g carbs, 131/188g protein. ive been doing the fat loss program for only 2 weeks so far, so im in part 1/3 of it. i want to lose body fat but not at the expense of alot of muscle is why i wonder if i should put a strength/hypertrophy program in between the fat loss program parts. my current body fat is 13%. another question i thought of is, my 6 meals of the day consist of 3 moderate meals + 3 healthy snacks. how i have it divided up is about 600 cals/meal, and 200 cals/snack. should i lessen meal calories and up snack calories to keep my metabolism more constant?

i got this workout program from the book, "Men's Health Big Book of Exercises" and part 1 consists of workouts a, b, c to be done mon, wed, fri for 4 weeks. i also added an ab workout to the end of my workouts but before cardio. should i stretch after im done lifting, but before cardio, so the muscles that arent used during cardio have a chance to cool down? heres my a, b, c workouts

Workout A
2 Super sets of (
Barbell step-up 15 reps
Dumbbell Bench Press 15 reps)

2 Super sets of (
Dumbbell Row 15 reps
Scaption 15 reps)

2 Super sets of (
Seated dumbbell external rotation 15 reps
Plank 40 sec)

3 Giant sets of (
Cable Core Press 10 reps/side
Reverse Crunch 12 reps
Barbell Rollout (I just use the ab roller handle w/ wheels) 8 reps)
Workout B

3 Super Sets of (
Barbell Split Squat 15 reps
Pushup 10 reps)

3 Super Sets of (
Inverted row 10 reps
Combo Shoulder raise 10 reps)

3 Super sets of (
Lying external rotation 10 reps
Side plank 50 sec)

3 Giant Sets of (
Kneeling stability chop 8 reps/side
Swiss-ball plank 30 sec
Swiss-ball roll out 8 reps)
Workout C

3 Super sets of (
Barbell stepup 10 reps
Dumbbell Bench press 10 reps)

3 Super sets of (
Dumbbell row 10 reps
Scaption 10 reps)

2 Super sets of (
Seated dumbbell external rotation 10 reps
Plank 60 sec)

3 Giant sets of (
Single-arm cable chest press 10 reps/side
Standing stability chop 10 reps/side
Rolling side plank 2 reps @ 5 sec/position)

Cardio for about 40 mins @ about 60%-70% with varying inclines depending on which treadmill program i choose :) after every workout

For all these exercises i use a weight that i start to struggle with a few reps away from the end of my reps of a set and i rest for about 25 sec between each exercise

thank you in advance! :)
Last Edit: 2 years 8 months ago by khamil8686. Reason: forgot workouts b and c
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Re: muscle gain + fat loss workout juggling 2 years 8 months ago #35607

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i got the calorie totals from the trainer at my gym, he said 3000 is good for strength/hypertrophy if you want to be cautious with your body fat, but 3400 would be best for gains. i also calculated my recommended daily calories for weight maintenance with a few methods i found online and also online calculators which all said around 2600 cals/day for maintenance since im very active. then he said for fat loss just reduce my strength/hypertrophy calories by about 500 cals.

3000 is just very general and generic for anyone to say that I shsould take in 3000 cals for me i would get fat and put on some muscle, but it wouldn't look right either. I mean i would like to have an age, weight, and height and then in order for things to happen for you the best way, I would then suggest a total numbers of Protein/carbs/fats to eat each day and then you would need to reach those totals consistently to know if it all was working, because what if your metabolism is a bit slower than the norm? we would adjust your carbs and cals, and to me a 100 g's of fat in a day a bit too much to lose fat and keep muscle yes we need fat but not that much and you need to probably hit a higher protein numbers and then readjust your carbs as well. I mean I would try and play around with some of your numbers week to to try and drop off bodyfat,not sure how high yours is? Need those things just to get you to learn how to do things right. A lot of trainers at gyms are full of a lot of BS and don't really know how to eat properly nor even train for that matter.

so weight?
bodytfat%?
height?


177 I just saw that, now for that I would probably be near 225 protein, and carbs I would start around there too and adjust each week after each weigh in and fats be near 50-60 per day!



i measure all my foods daily via myfitnesspal.com app on my smartphone. i weigh 177lbs and yesterday i got 61/100g fat, 339/338g carbs, 131/188g protein. ive been doing the fat loss program for only 2 weeks so far, so im in part 1/3 of it. i want to lose body fat but not at the expense of alot of muscle is why i wonder if i should put a strength/hypertrophy program in between the fat loss program parts. my current body fat is 13%. another question i thought of is, my 6 meals of the day consist of 3 moderate meals + 3 healthy snacks. how i have it divided up is about 600 cals/meal, and 200 cals/snack. should i lessen meal calories and up snack calories to keep my metabolism more constant?

The bodyfat is getting down there from the norms so form there we might have to cycle it down with a higher carb day here or there and the snacks could come up and the try and keep your carbs around your workouts!

i got this workout program from the book, "Men's Health Big Book of Exercises" and part 1 consists of workouts a, b, c to be done mon, wed, fri for 4 weeks. i also added an ab workout to the end of my workouts but before cardio. should i stretch after im done lifting, but before cardio, so the muscles that arent used during cardio have a chance to cool down? heres my a, b, c workouts

Workout A
2 Super sets of (
Barbell step-up 15 reps
Dumbbell Bench Press 15 reps)

2 Super sets of (
Dumbbell Row 15 reps
Scaption 15 reps)

2 Super sets of (
Seated dumbbell external rotation 15 reps
Plank 40 sec)

3 Giant sets of (
Cable Core Press 10 reps/side
Reverse Crunch 12 reps
Barbell Rollout (I just use the ab roller handle w/ wheels) 8 reps)
Workout B

3 Super Sets of (
Barbell Split Squat 15 reps
Pushup 10 reps)

3 Super Sets of (
Inverted row 10 reps
Combo Shoulder raise 10 reps)

3 Super sets of (
Lying external rotation 10 reps
Side plank 50 sec)

3 Giant Sets of (
Kneeling stability chop 8 reps/side
Swiss-ball plank 30 sec
Swiss-ball roll out 8 reps)
Workout C

3 Super sets of (
Barbell stepup 10 reps
Dumbbell Bench press 10 reps)

3 Super sets of (
Dumbbell row 10 reps
Scaption 10 reps)

2 Super sets of (
Seated dumbbell external rotation 10 reps
Plank 60 sec)

3 Giant sets of (
Single-arm cable chest press 10 reps/side
Standing stability chop 10 reps/side
Rolling side plank 2 reps @ 5 sec/position)

Cardio for about 40 mins @ about 60%-70% with varying inclines depending on which treadmill program i choose after every workout

For all these exercises i use a weight that i start to struggle with a few reps away from the end of my reps of a set and i rest for about 25 sec between each exercise

thank you in advance!

I would do something a little more strength oriented and maybe stay away from all of these supersets as they are kind of like doing a double cardio sessions and will further catabolize your muscle. Using more weight will help to retain muscle and keep your metabolism from going into the gutter

I do work with people online, but again lots of misinformation out there and would work with heavier workouts and split this into a 4 day split!
Craig Yarnall, CSCS, CPT, WNBF Pro
"Want a Bigger BODY, shut up and SQUAT, DEEP!!!!"
"Lifetime Natural Bodybuilder"
"Train Hard and Stay Natural"
"Dr. Joe, Jr."
Last Edit: 2 years 8 months ago by Cytrainer913.
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Re: muscle gain + fat loss workout juggling 2 years 8 months ago #35610

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im 24, 25 on aug 6 so basically im 25 :p 177 lbs and 5"7' currently at 13% body fat. i do have a high carb day here and there, i try to stick to 1x a week and ill goto a buffet with my family, i try to stick to eating mostly high protein stuff and veggies when im there but hard to pass some things up! so heavier workouts and less supersetting? should i just switch to a strength training program from my book and rely on diet + some cardio after workouts for the fat loss?
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Re: muscle gain + fat loss workout juggling 2 years 8 months ago #35611

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you could take one like this and alternate between heavy and lighter volume weeks!:



Power/Core Lift/Strength Workout
Rotation 2 days on/ 1 day off
Day 1-Chest/Tris/Abs
Bench Press/ Incline Press/ Incline DB/ DB Press-5-7 sets with 3 working sets
Of reps of 5-10 reps but to be in the lower end range to get full effect. Pick 2 of the 4 exercises from the above listed!! No warm ups on second exercise!!!!
Triceps- Lying extensions/ Close grip bench press
3-4 sets 5-10 reps one exercise only
Abs- 3 exercises weighted if possible 8-12 reps
Hanging legs Raises, Cable crunches, Bicycles
Day 2-Legs/Calves
Squats- 7-9 sets with 3-5 working sets
Reps can be as follows= 20,20,20,15,10,5,5,5,2
Reps range can be from 5-10 reps, if reps stay high then increase the weight,
Remember it is a Power Workout
Stiff-legged Deadlifts- 6 sets of 6-10 reps
Reps will be as follows= 10,10,8,5,5,5
Calves- Standing calf Raises/ Seated calf Raises 3-4 sets of 6-10 reps
Day 3 – OFF
Day 4- Shoulders/Traps/ Abs
Shoulders Press Bar/ DB Press/ Standing Power Press- 5-7 sets 3 working sets of
5-10 reps choose one exercise
Laterals/ Power Pulls(Wide Grip)- 5 sets of 5-10 reps No warm ups on second exercise!!!! choose one exercise
Hammer Shrugs/ DB Shrugs/ Power Cleans/ Barbell Shrugs- 5 sets of 5-10 reps
choose one exercise
Abs- Leg Raises off Bench or BOSU w/ weight 3 sets 12-15 reps,
Cable Twists from the top and bottom 3 sets each 6-10 reps
Cable crunches 3 sets of 10-12 reps
Day 5- Back/ Bis/ Calves
Pull ups- 2 warm ups followed by 4 sets of reps around 4-6 range; add weight if needed
Deadlifts- 5-7 sets couple of sets to acclimate then 5-10 rep range
Barbell/ DB/ Hammer Strength Curls- 3-4 sets of 5-10 reps choose one exercise
Calves- Standing calf Raises/ Seated calf Raises 3-4 sets of 6-10 reps
Day 6- OFF
Day 7- Volume workout (Next Page)


then go a lighter week of the same 4 day split:

Volume/ High Intensity Workout
Rotation 2 days on/ 1 day off
Day 1-Chest/Tris/Abs
Bench Press/ Incline Press/ Incline DB/ DB Press- 5 sets 2 warm ups with 3 working sets 10-15 reps high intensity choose one exercise
Hammer Strength Bench/ DB Flye/ Pec Dec- 3 sets of 12-15 reps No warm ups!!! Choose one exercise after last set back to exercise one and to failure 20-25 reps range
Pushdowns/ Rope Extensions/ Reverse Pushdowns- 4 sets of 12-15 reps last set to be supersetted with lying extensions to failure 20-25 reps and then use that same weight and fail out on close grip bench choose one exercise
Abs- All exercises to be supersetted- Hanging leg raises, cable crunches, and bicycles
Weighted if possible 3 sets of 12-15 reps
Day 2-Legs/Calves
Leg presses- high reps range reps 25,25,25,20,15,10,10 some sets to 25-50 reps
Leg Extensions- 15 reps, 10 reps with holds on top
Back to Leg Press for 50 rep set
Leg Curls- 5 sets 20,15,12,8f,5f
Then one all out set Walking Lunges 15 steps each leg
Seated Calf Raises- 3-4 sets of 12-15 reps supersetted with Standing Calf Raises
Day 3- OFF
Day 4- Shoulders/ Traps/ Abs
Arnold Presses/ DB Presses/ Barbell Presses- 5 sets of 12-15 reps 1-2 sets of warm ups
Rear Laterals- 3 sets of 12-15 reps followed by laterals to failure 20-25 reps
Barbell/ Hammer Shrugs- 4 sets of 12-15 reps supersetted with DB Shrugs to failure
Abs- leg raises off bench w/ weight 3 sets of 12-15 reps
Cable Twists from the top and bottom 3 sets each 6-10 reps
Cable crunches 3 sets of 10-12 reps, all sets dropped 3X
Day 5- Back/ Bis/ Calves
DB Rows/ Cable Rows/ Pulldowns- 5 sets 12-15 reps a couple of warm up sets high intensity choose two exercises
Pullovers- 3 sets of 12-15 reps
As soon as 3rd set is of pullovers is done, back to exercise one to failure 15-25 reps
Incline curls/ DB curls/ Barbell curls- 4 sets 10-15 range choose one exercise
As soon as last set is over go to Spyder Curls to failure 15-25 rep range
Seated Calf Raises- 3-4 sets of 12-15 reps supersetted with Standing Calf Raises
Day 6- OFF
Day 7- Power Workout
Craig Yarnall, CSCS, CPT, WNBF Pro
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"Lifetime Natural Bodybuilder"
"Train Hard and Stay Natural"
"Dr. Joe, Jr."
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Re: muscle gain + fat loss workout juggling 2 years 8 months ago #35612

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Don't ever forget to make these three lifts a staple of any good lifting program and they will show the greatest gains in muscle and losses in terms of fat loss!

SQUAT


DEADLIFT


BENCH PRESS

Usually no one has issues with keeping out the last one!

A good leg workout will utilize fat losses and keep the lean muscle gains and help to release the proper hormones!!
Craig Yarnall, CSCS, CPT, WNBF Pro
"Want a Bigger BODY, shut up and SQUAT, DEEP!!!!"
"Lifetime Natural Bodybuilder"
"Train Hard and Stay Natural"
"Dr. Joe, Jr."
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Re: muscle gain + fat loss workout juggling 2 years 8 months ago #35613

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another saying that will be the best way to look at abs and see them is this:

Diet is so critical and it can't be all over the place, must be tracked for most normal human who want to see change unless your a genetic freak!

ABS ARE MADE IN THE KITCHEN.


Some cardio but never fasted in the am eat something please and if you can learn to do HIIT cardio! Quick and easy and very effective!
Craig Yarnall, CSCS, CPT, WNBF Pro
"Want a Bigger BODY, shut up and SQUAT, DEEP!!!!"
"Lifetime Natural Bodybuilder"
"Train Hard and Stay Natural"
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Re: muscle gain + fat loss workout juggling 2 years 8 months ago #35614

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Great information Cytrainer
Lift for Life - Natural Bodybuilding at it's Finest!
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Re: muscle gain + fat loss workout juggling 2 years 8 months ago #35620

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Is there a reason that any of this stuff wasn't responded to?


I know a lot of times once the word SQUAT is written for an exercise it can scare many away!

I gave you a great 4 day split to go back and forth between heavy and light workouts? tried to give you some numbers to follow? So anything?
Craig Yarnall, CSCS, CPT, WNBF Pro
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"Lifetime Natural Bodybuilder"
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Re: muscle gain + fat loss workout juggling 2 years 8 months ago #35621

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i clicked thank you on your post about the workout and thought it would tell you that i did, but it must not :p squats dont scare me away, i like them cuz they really make me work up a sweat! ill write the workouts down and start them. thank you for all the information! it was very helpful! :)
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Re: muscle gain + fat loss workout juggling 2 years 8 months ago #35622

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Cytrainer913 wrote:
Don't ever forget to make these three lifts a staple of any good lifting program and they will show the greatest gains in muscle and losses in terms of fat loss!

1.SQUAT


2.DEADLIFT


3. BENCH PRESS

Usually no one has issues with keeping out the last one!

A good leg workout will utilize fat losses and keep the lean muscle gains and help to release the proper hormones!!



4. ABS ARE MADE IN THE KITCHEN.


If anyone truly wants to make changes in their body regardless of what body part it may be, follow those 4 things and I promise changes are right around the corner!

Sorry about that didn't see it, so keep climbing that forward to a new you!
Craig Yarnall, CSCS, CPT, WNBF Pro
"Want a Bigger BODY, shut up and SQUAT, DEEP!!!!"
"Lifetime Natural Bodybuilder"
"Train Hard and Stay Natural"
"Dr. Joe, Jr."
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Re: muscle gain + fat loss workout juggling 2 years 8 months ago #35623

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finally had time to sit down and read fully through the workout routine but had some questions.
-For day 1 of power workout, do i choose just one exercise, lying extensions/close grip bench press or do 3-4 sets of each exercise?
-For day 1 of power, abs, do i do a single set for each of the 3 weighted ab exercises? so 3 sets total?
-for day 2 power workout, what is "Reps can be as follows= 20,20,20,15,10,5,5,5,2"? i see you used that notation a few times but ive never seen it used before since i recently started choosing my workouts instead of letting a computer decide for me :)
-early on in the high intensity workout day 1 you say after the last set of the second exercise to do an exercise from the first set of exercises to failure 20-25 reps, do you mean i should use a weight where i fail around 20-25 reps?
-on the exercise i mentioned above, superset an exercise from exercise one choices means no rest between the 2 sets right?
-how much do i rest between each of the other exercises? as little as possible since its fat loss or should i do 30sec or so?
-could you explain the leg presses of day 2 volume/high intensity workout? i dont understand the reps or sets im supposed to do (maybe i just dont understand the notation)
-day 2 of volume/high intensity workout, what is "20,15,12,8f,5f"?
-day 2 of vol/high intensity workout, what is "one allout set" for the walking lunges?
-day 4 of high vol/intensity workout, cable crunches, what is all sets dropped to 3X?
-day 5 of high vol/intensity workout, db rows/cable rows/pulldowns it mentions a high intensity warm up, what is a high intensity warmup?

thank you cytrainer913! :)
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Re: muscle gain + fat loss workout juggling 2 years 8 months ago #35625

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-For day 1 of power workout, do i choose just one exercise, lying extensions/close grip bench press or do 3-4 sets of each exercise?
Just one exercise for the power day


-For day 1 of power, abs, do i do a single set for each of the 3 weighted ab exercises? so 3 sets total?
See how you feel at the end of the workout and try to do three but if you can do one or 2 that's just fine


-for day 2 power workout, what is "Reps can be as follows= 20,20,20,15,10,5,5,5,2"? i see you used that notation a few times but ive never seen it used before since i recently started choosing my workouts instead of letting a computer decide for me
I used to do more warm ups but still do warm up thoroughly, doing a set of 15,12,8,and sometimes a 6 then the 4 sets of 5 and a set of 2--> last 5 sets are the important ones


-early on in the high intensity workout day 1 you say after the last set of the second exercise to do an exercise from the first set of exercises to failure 20-25 reps, do you mean i should use a weight where i fail around 20-25 reps?
go back and use the compound exercise and try to hit it all out for a set of 20-25 reps

-on the exercise i mentioned above, superset an exercise from exercise one choices means no rest between the 2 sets right?
yes do them back to back

-how much do i rest between each of the other exercises? as little as possible since its fat loss or should i do 30sec or so?
power weeks-3-4 min
volume weeks-about 1 min


-could you explain the leg presses of day 2 volume/high intensity workout? i dont understand the reps or sets im supposed to do (maybe i just dont understand the notation)
It's about higher volume and reps so you try and really hit some rep ranges that are above at least 15 everytime and the can even go higher once in a while and do up to 50 reps in a set

-day 2 of volume/high intensity workout, what is "20,15,12,8f,5f"?
1st three sets are not to failure and the last 2 sets are to failure

-day 2 of vol/high intensity workout, what is "one allout set" for the walking lunges?
go to failure!

-day 4 of high vol/intensity workout, cable crunches, what is all sets dropped to 3X?
do a set drop the weight to continue and again and again so you do it 4 times totals with 3 drops in the sets!

this just refers to the higher rep sets of 12-15 reps

You can also see how I morphed my workouts in my journals and workout frequency to see how i do a three week cycles and sample workouts as well

heavy week
light week
medium week
Craig Yarnall, CSCS, CPT, WNBF Pro
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"Lifetime Natural Bodybuilder"
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"Dr. Joe, Jr."
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